tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9156334464585894857.post1396932475899687203..comments2023-10-25T05:30:54.507-04:00Comments on Oh Get A Grip!: Jesus was an Alien & my Minister was an AtheistAshe Barkerhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03390519279886657608noreply@blogger.comBlogger4125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9156334464585894857.post-85905321095210074912017-09-03T20:31:37.763-04:002017-09-03T20:31:37.763-04:00I think the highest value of religion is to nurtur...I think the highest value of religion is to nurture people who will "use their religious beliefs to do good in the world." The question of belief in God is a tricky one, but I can see how acting according to such a belief can be be a good thing even if you don't seriously believe in a deity.Sacchi Greenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10801164916418570059noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9156334464585894857.post-77423201809763068132017-08-31T13:50:14.386-04:002017-08-31T13:50:14.386-04:00As a United Church member myself, I like the fact ...As a United Church member myself, I like the fact that we're free to have our own views or opinions on things -- which I know is not true of all churches. (My husband and I used to have some friends who were told by their minister to stop being our friends because we're gay ... so they did. They asked my husband to read a Bible verse (one that can be interpreted to be anti-gay) and then we never saw them again.) With the fluidity of the United Church, I can go to church (or not) and it's okay if I agree (or disagree) with the message of the week. None of this impacts my involvement or lack of involvement with the congregation I attend.<br /><br />And Greta Vosper is/was quite the shit disturber. It's perfectly normal for any person, including ministers, to question their belief in God / higher being, but when a minister answers a call in the United Church of Canada, they do agree to uphold some basic tenets, one of which is the existence of God. If I remember right, it's the very first line in the statement of belief that all ministers agree to and all congregations abide by. From that point on, it's fairly open -- acknowledging the existence of God doesn't imply *how* a minister is supposed to interpret their understanding of God, hence there are fairly conservative and fairly liberal congregations within the United Church of Canada. I was quite involved in national church policy right around the time that Vosper started proclaiming quite loudly that she is atheist, though my work was not at all connected to those addressing Vosper. It is her right to hold those beliefs and I have no right to judge her for them -- but I was quite confused by her insistence that she remain a United Church minister. Why would you continue to work for an organization whose very nature contradicts one of your fundamental beliefs? I look at it this way -- I am a gay man, so why would I ever want to hold onto a job with an employer that is overtly anti-gay? That fundamental part of myself would be at odds with a fundamental part of my employer.<br /><br />However, the United Church is a "grounds up" organization, where it is the congregation members who make all the real decisions, not the upper management in the Toronto offices. Presumably, and I haven't followed the Vosper issue much since I stepped back from the national policy work I was involved in, she had gathered a congregation with beliefs similar to hers -- and if I recall correctly, that was part of the issue. The congregation was on the side of the minister, which limited how much the national church could intervene.<br /><br />As you mention, though -- if the minister doesn't believe in God, then why should someone who attends the church believe in God? And if that's the case, what's the point of attending the church to begin with?Cameron D. Jameshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05825600675668853636noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9156334464585894857.post-77273106506583469172017-08-31T10:43:07.851-04:002017-08-31T10:43:07.851-04:00Religious teaching should be presented as a compar...Religious teaching should be presented as a comparison of belief systems, not dogma. But of course, religions outside of universities are usually taught by zealots stuck to one idea. And they'll die trying to prove the unprovable. One thing that rings true about zealots is that somebody willing to give their life for a cause wouldn't think twice about offering yours.Daddy Xhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12927663248424944119noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9156334464585894857.post-64535034659185679822017-08-31T08:55:49.061-04:002017-08-31T08:55:49.061-04:00I think you were fortunate not to have religion cr...I think you were fortunate not to have religion crammed down your throat. Lucky too that you had grandparents willing to take your questions seriously.<br /><br />Greta Vosper sounds like quite a character.Lisabet Saraihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05162514190572269660noreply@blogger.com